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In Sue Fox's Own Words.....
I
found out about female boxing
when I watched the news one day on October 24, 1975. They were
broadcasting the results of a female bout that had just taken place the
night before between boxers, Caroline Svendsen,
34, and Jean Lange, 35, at the Expo Center, in Portland, Oregon. The news revealed that the fight was the first sanctioned female bout in the State of
Oregon. When they reported that the women were paid to fight, it immediately
hit me that I was actually paying to fight in karate tournaments!
I had at that time about 30 plus amateur fights in Martial
Arts, competing in many karate tournaments
throughout the Northwest.
The next day, I started
calling around to the boxing gyms to find
out how a person would go about becoming a boxer. I ended up talking
to a guy, Abe T., who supposedly managed fighters. He immediately
volunteered to take me under his wing as a
manager.
Undefeated Full-contact Karate Fighter - 6-0-0
Won Full-Contact championships Brown/Black belt Division
1977 and 1978 - Portland, Oregon, USA
Little did I know,
my
newly-found manager did not appear to have my interest at heart. Being young and
new to the sport I knew that I needed management and a trainer, but I did
not know anyone in the business. Abe's enthusiasm and immediate acceptance
of me probably should have been a warning sign, but I wanted to fight!
Abe told me
that he would get me a fight with a girl by the name of Theresa
"Red Star" Kibby. He said that Kibby had never had a fight, had
been only boxing casually for two years and was not in very good shape. I
had wanted to fight Caroline Svendsen, and/or Jean Lange.
It was quite a publicity gimmick--female black belt against female
boxer. The news media went into a frenzy about the match and did several
feature stories about the upcoming fight. There was quite a bit of hype over
the whole ordeal. My newly-found "manager" never even bothered to
get me a boxing trainer. He let me continue to train at my karate
school with my karate instructor, no
boxing ring, no proper boxing equipment—nothing. The fight was set to go on February 12, 1976, so
with about 3-4 months of boxing training in a karate
school, I was faced to
fight Kibby.
Two
days before my fight, I began to read newspaper articles in the local papers
about my opponent's background. I quickly found out that Kibby had not been boxing
for two years---she had been boxing for close to thirteen years with her two brothers, who
were also professional boxers. In fact, one of the brothers was listed
on the same boxing card as Kibby and me.
After I got over
the shock of the unexpected information, I immediately called my manager to
find out why he had not told me the truth. He tried to calm my fears.
He then
"sprung" another new piece of information on me.
He told me that the fight
would be four three-minute rounds, not two-minute rounds as originally agreed upon. I
quickly figured out that "he was definitely the best man on their team."
It was not only sad to have a person, my supposed manager,
have my best interest at heart, and if this deception man had that, he never
would have put me in this match until I had been boxing for at least two
years.
Needless to say,
this was no "Rocky" story, and the bout was a disaster. The referee stopped the fight in the third round,
after I was too stubborn to fall down. What was unfortunate
for me and for other martial artists was that everybody thought that I would win
because of being a black belt. They did not realize that I had been duped, and by
taking away my powerful leg kicks, I was just a "bad boxer."
(With research done on this
particular bout, WBAN found out that this fight was actually not sanctioned by the Oregon Athletic
Boxing Commission, and results were never given to FightFax, it ends up
being no more than an exhibition). Both
the commission and FightFax, the official record keeper of the
fight, stated that there was no record of this fight being
sanctioned.
I did
recoup from my "not-so-great" start in professional boxing.
I moved
down to California to get into a boxing gym with a competent boxing trainer and
manager. I found a gym in Westminster, California, that World Welterweight
Champion, Carlos Palomino trained at. The first day I walked in, I approached one of
the trainers, and asked him if I could use the gym to train. He reluctantly
said that I could. I told him that I would start the following day.
The next day, I took my equipment to the gym and started warming up.
All of the male fighters completely ignored me. They walked to the shower area in their
underwear, acting like I did not exist. After about a half hour or so, one of the
trainers approached me and asked me if I wanted to go four rounds with one of their
fighters. I was eager to do that because I thought, "all right" they
are going to accept me in the gym. I put my headgear and gloves on, my
sparring partner got his equipment on, and we proceeded to spar four three-minute rounds.
This little fighter who was much lighter than me, probably a bantamweight, proceeded to
kick the wholly daylights out of me, even with a head gear on. I got body
punched, hooked, and who knows what else during those four rounds.
At the end of the fourth round, my body
felt like someone had just put me through a meat grinder. I was exhausted, and
shocked at what a beating I just took. Even though I was hurting, I went to my
sparring partner and shook his hands while still gloved up. I thanked him for sparring
with me, and told him that I would like to spar with him the following day.
Little
did he know that, THAT was the last thing I wanted to do!
The
next day before going to the gym, I dreaded having to face him again in the
ring. I knew that if I failed to show up at the gym that I would never save
face in the gym. I decided then that if I had to take a "beating" everyday
from those fighters, I would. I loved boxing that much.
The following day, I walked in the gym, ready to take my punishment. To my amazement, the
guy that beat me up the previous day was not there. I cannot even begin to tell you how
relieved I was, and I didn’t care to ask why he was not in the gym.
After about
a week of not seeing him though, my curiosity got the better of me and I asked one of the
trainers what happened to him. He proceeded to tell me that my "sparring
partner" was instructed to KNOCK ME OUT, and that when he was unable
to do that, he was too humiliated to return to the gym. I never saw that fighter again.
I trained for about
9-12 months in Carlos Palomino's gym, and during that entire time, I
did not have one conversation with Carlos other than, "Hi and bye."
His
trainer did finally break down and say one thing to me. I was thrilled when he
called me over to the side of the ring while I was sparring with someone.
I
immediately went to where he was standing and he then proceeded to tell me that he wanted to give me a word
of advice. He said to me that if I could not "at least"
jog five miles a day, to quit boxing. Palomino's trainer woke me up with that
startling statement. I was running about three miles a day, but it was obvious to
him that it was not nearly enough. From that day forward, I added another three
miles on the road at night.
A fighter that Fox deeply admire and fought
in 1977- Gwen Gemini - Fox considered Gemini one of the best female boxers in the sport,
and always felt that Gemini was a a much better boxer then herself...
Documentation of Sue Fox vs. Gwen Gemini
Tale of Tape: Gemini, Pro record: 14-1-1, - Fox, 4-2-2
documented program, Portland, OR - 1977
fight ended in a four-round draw
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NBC's Tomorrow Show with Tom Snyder
Gwen Gemini and Sue Fox did a quick
Exhibition bout, where they had a ring set up in the Television
studio, and then they were interviewed by Synder, along with boxing
Manager Dee Knuckles -July 7, 1977
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Even though I did receive a little notoriety
as a boxer, there were many setbacks in the 1970's, during my boxing career.
One
of the major setbacks for me and other female boxers was when
Top Rank made
an offer to me and other top contenders. (Letter
of offered to Kibby, I was offered the same deal) They wanted to sign us for a one-year
contract, guaranteeing us three national fights, paying us $15,000, whether we fought or
not. I was told that the reason they later withdrew their offer
was the negative feedback from the public after the airing of the (Sports Spectacular) televised nationally a Welterweight Championship fight
between Teresa Kibby and
Lavonne Ludian
at the Aladdin Hotel in Las Vegas, Nevada on April 16, 1977. What they didn't know
was that even though Ludian had the flu and was very ill, that she fought
anyway.
Another setback for my career, was when I was offered a fight with Lavonne
Ludian,
and her manager would not accept a rematch with me at the Caesar's Palace in Las Vegas in
1977. I had fought Ludian on May 1, 1977, previously at the
Sahara Tahoe, in Lake Tahoe, Nevada. [Fight
Report]
This was a venue that was a hometown for Ludian. The fight ended in a
four-round controversial draw. I had almost knocked her out in the first round
according to the Nevada State Journal, who wrote that Ludian admitted to
seeing the lights of Vegas. This fight was also named "Fight of the
Month" according to Dee Knuckles and Bill Dickson. I was later offered
to fight her on a big card that was headlining Ernie Shavers at the Caesar's
Palace, in Las Vegas, Nevada. Mr. T Promotions offered Ludian $5,000, and
I was offered $2,500. Ludian turned down the fight
according to promoter Bill Dickson.
I decided to hang up the gloves after it
became obvious that female boxing was
beginning to die out. I went back to
college to pursue my dream of becoming a police officer. I worked different
jobs, until I finally was hired in March of 1990 as a police officer.
My personal thoughts about boxing....In
total I had about 12 plus fights with some of those fights being just
exhibitions. Before I boxed professionally, I had about 30
amateur light-contact, and full-contact Karate competitions.
There were no opportunities for female boxers in the amateur arena, so in
the past all of us had to step immediately into the ring as a pro in order
to gain any experience. When I turned pro, I did not have a real
boxing trainer, no ring to train in, no wraps ever put on my hands,
absolutely clueless about what boxing was about, only training 3-4 months
before my first fight.
I was a perfect victim at the first part
of my boxing career for unscrupulous people in the sport to take advantage
of someone who did not know what was going on.....I did not learn the
"ropes" of boxing, until I let loose of my Karate Instructor, relocated to
Los Angeles, California, began training in the Westminster Gym, that housed
world champion Carlos Palomino, and I was truly exposed to real boxing,
training in a
real boxing ring and equipment, with genuine boxing trainers.
This is one of the top reasons for the continuing driving force that I have
personally strived for, in regards to other female boxers who are talked into
mismatches, over-matches, etc.-----mainly, I know what it feels like,
because I
lived it firsthand in the past.
[Miscellaneous
fight report]
After boxing, Fox
also
pursued other
ambitions, playing music professionally
since 1981 until current at this time, in one band entitled "Prime Tyme
Band.
She sings lead/and backups, plays keyboards, alto sax, guitar,
and bass guitar. She also
fulfilled her goal to become a police officer/detective retiring in 2008.
Additional background:
Fox was an undefeated Full-Contact
fighter 6-0, earning two Northwest Championships, 1977-1978; three
years amateur competition in Karate tournaments, with about 30+ fights
in tournaments, before boxing professionally. Earned black belt
in 1975; 1976-First woman in the State of Washington
to obtain a boxing
license;
1977-First woman licensed in State of Utah; first woman licensed in the
State of Montana, 1976. Ranked #1 in the world by the WBB and WBBA as a
welterweight (Champion spot was vacant); Ranked #2 Welterweight 1978;
Ranked #3 in 1977, ranked #3 in 1980, middleweight (WBB). In 1977, two fights were named "Fighter
of the month". Charlene Anthony vs. Sue Fox,
Silver
Slipper, in
Las Vegas, Nevada. Also, Lavonne Ludian vs. Sue Fox, Sahara's
Tahoe Resort, Lake Tahoe, Nevada. Appeared on the Tomorrow
Show with Tom Snyder, July 1977, and featured on other television news
stations and
features in the Northwest.
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After Sue Fox boxed in the past...
In the year 2002, Fox featured in the 2002 Brown Prizefighters
Collection male
and female boxers that included Alex "The Bronx Bomber" Ramos, Oquendo, Paz, Brian Viloria, Ricky Hatton, Jermain Taylor, Christy
Martin, Sumya Anani, and many more.
Fox's
personal goal for WBAN was to make
its own history...
On June 13,
2008, at
the Isleta Casino & Resort, in Albuquerque, New Mexico, and
televised on Pay-Per-View, the boxing event "FINALLY" debuted the
first-ever independent world title WBAN belts for females. WBAN
"Finally"” made its own history in the
sport! It coincided with WBAN's tenth anniversary on the net. What better way to celebrate those
ten years
then to honor the top female boxers in the world with a prestigious
independent world title belt for being the
"best of the best" in the sport.
On this night, WBAN awarded two women boxers in its "history
first". One WBAN belt was awarded to Holly Holm, after
she defeated Mary Jo Sanders in a 10-round unanimous decision. In a second bout, WBAN awarded the best of the best, between Chevelle Hallback vs. Jeannine Garside. Hallback received the belt
after winning a 10-round unanimous decision over Garside--leaving no
doubt that this was the "Fight of the Night."
On October 9, 2009, in a
history-first in Europe, in Marseilles, France, Myriam Lamare of France,
faced Ann
Marie Saccurato. Lamare not only won the WBF Junior Welterweight World
title, but also the FIRST WBAN Junior Welterweight Independent belt
that had been awarded out of the United States. Lamare and Saccurato made history for WBAN by fighting for the first
WBAN Independent belt in Europe.
On December 3, 2010, WBAN again
made its own history when Holly Holm fought Ann Marie Saccurato for the WBAN
junior welterweight title,
as it was the first time that WBAN had two boxers fighting a "second
time" for our belt.
Holly Holm was already the WBAN Junior Middleweight belt when she had fought
Mary Jo Sanders in June of 2008. Saccurato had fought for the junior welterweight
title over a year prior, fighting Myriam Lamare, who [Lamare]
ultimately won. On this date of December 3rd, Holm
defeated Saccurato by a eighth
round TKO, and she became the first female boxer in history to win two WBAN
Belts!
In yet another
history-first with the WBAN belt, Holly Holm fought a third time
for a WBAN belt, and it would be ultimately for the WBAN
Welterweight world title. Holm fought Anne Sophie Mathis
on December 3, 2011, and lost that fight by being stopped by
Mathis by KO. Mathis from France is currently our WBAN
Welterweight champion. On June 15, 2012, in New Mexico,
Holly Holm rematched with Mathis, winning the WBAN World
Welterweight title.
Fox
Named in the "Top
Ten" as Most Influential in the sport of all time - Ring Magazine - February
2012
Sue Fox Named in the "Top Ten" Most -Significant Female
Boxers of
All Time - Ring Magazine - Feb. 2012
In February of 2012, Fox was named as one of the top ten
female boxers of all time as one of the Most-Influential in the sport, by Ring
Magazine, 90-year anniversary commemorative Issue, February 2012. Other
women in the top ten, Christy Martin, Laila Ali, Grace Cassilas, Lady Tyger
Trimiar, and more... [Link]
In the Ring Magazine, August 2013 issue, Fox
was featured in the magazine, titled "Sue Fox - Standard Bearer". It
centered on Fox's contribution to the sport of women's boxing after she
stopped boxing.
On September 20, 2013, Sue TL Fox
was honored by the WBC Cares Colorado members, Stephen Blea and Raylene
Carbone for her contribution to the sport.
Letter
sent to WBAN.
On November 9, 2013, the Fox was
inducted into the Hall of Fame by the Golden
State Boxers Association who honored eight females both Boxers and females
outside the ring with California connections to the sport, who have made a
significant impact in the world of boxing. Besides Fox, Layla McCarter,
Lucia Rijker, Jacqui Richardson, Gwen Adair, Michele Chong, Carol Steindler
received an induction Hall of Fame Award from this organization.
Press
Release
|
Hall of Fame Award along with a Award
Certificate from the City of Los Angeles, California |
In October 2017, Fox was asked to join Thomas Gerbasi, the current women's boxing columnist for
The
Ring magazine, to be a part of the voting committee for the
history-first Boxing Writers Association of America [BWAA] Award to be
awarded to the top fighter of the year. Along with Gerbasi, David
Avila, a respected journalist and longtime supporter of the sport, Fox is a
BWAA member. Full
Story
On October 17, 2021, at the Loew's Hotel, in
Hollywood, California, Sue TL Fox was inducted into the West Coast Boxing
Hall of Fame with many of the greats, as Oscar de la Hoya, Michael Nunn, Roy
Englebrecht, and more!
Sue TL Fox inducted into the Hall of fame
with the West Coast Boxing Hall of Fame, Los Angeles, California, United
States
October 17, 2021-Photo credit: Nate Wren
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Exhibition bouts:
About Fight Fax the Official Record Keeper:
WBAN
uncovered by extensive research with the Official Record Keeper for the
sport FIGHT FAX, and other sources, i.e., boxing commissions, that
many of these past fights that happened in the 70's were not sanctioned
bouts, and are in fact either "unsanctioned" or in many cases "exhibitions."
For an example, WBAN has historical documentation that Sue Fox talked
about her exhibitions to a reporter with the Columbian newspaper, talking
about her exhibitions. Below is the article dated 1977.
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Documentation
of Sue Fox fighting in some Exhibitions, and not all
Sanctioned bouts..... |
| Read what Fox said on Page 1 to the
Columbian Newspaper that she stated clearly in 1977.
|
Linda Harris vs. Sue TL Fox: January 1977:
Photos and Story in Hits * Misses Newsletter dated February 1977.
Written in this story, they said in summary that Fox's aggressive and
feisty "street style" with Harris' more subdued and scientific approach.
Harris' height advantage was offset by Fox's greater experience (she has
been training for about a year), and an unofficial decision in exhibition/sparring
bout
would have to go to Fox.
Gwen Gemini vs. Sue TL Fox - 1976: In Lake
Tahoe, Nevada, Gemini and Fox traveled with Dee Knuckles, and the agreement
with Fox was that this would only be a
four-round exhibition bout because
the promoter needed one more bout on the card.
Fox only took it for
experience as she had only had four fights at the time--and Gemini was
clearly the better and more experienced boxer. This was reported as a
sanctioned bout years later on the net (which at this point have no idea if
Knuckles lied to Fox, or it was indeed a regular bout). But Fox and Dee Knuckles had
agreed that it was an exhibition, and it was clearly an agreement with the
promoter who had even told Gemini to take it easy on Fox when they bumped
into the promoter in the Casino. Unfortunately, Fox found out years later,
that it was reported as a unanimous decision against Fox. The fight
was never reported to FightFax.
Exhibition/Fill-in rounds for Top Rank card--- Darlene Buckskin vs. Sue TL Fox - 1976 - Dee Knuckles initially offered Sue
Fox to come to Las Vegas for $300.00 to be a ALTERNATE for Theresa Kibby vs.
Lavonne Ludian who were fighting for a four-round title on Wide World of
Sports in case one or the other could not fight on that card.
Fox
received this offer because she had a draw with Ludian in "her" hometown
a week or two prior.
Two days before the fight Fox's then
boxing advisor Dee Knuckles said since Fox was going to Las Vegas anyway why
didn't she do an exhibition bout with Buckskin who was totally out of Fox's
weight class. Fox agreed to do that, and when she got to Las Vegas,
they did a weigh-in and with Buckskin out weighing Fox by at least 15
lbs, if not
more, Dee Knuckles piled dollar coins all over Fox in pockets and elsewhere to
bring her weight up. When Fox arrived in
Las Vegas, her TRUE WEIGHT was 145 lbs, as she was an alternate if anything
happened to the Welterweights fight between Ludian vs. Kibby.
Buckskin weighed in the mid 160's weight.
One judge had Fox winning the fight and two for
Buckskin, this was reported on BoxRec as a fight even though Fox had
explained this to this Internet site. This bout was not ever reported to the official boxing keeper FightFax.
Boxing Records sites on the net are unfortunately inaccurate when to
documenting the history of fights and exhibitions of Pioneers in the sport.
FightFax, the OFFICIAL BOXING RECORD site at the
time told Fox in 1999 that these bouts would be considered
EXHIBITIONS as they were never sent in by the commission to report them as
sanctioned bouts.
In the Columbian Newspaper, dated in 1977,
Fox was quoted with the writer, that she had had some exhibition bouts,
prior to her upcoming fight that she was having against Dino Cline at the
Expo Center, in Portland, OR, where she won by a TKO over Cline.
Other types of matches - Mixed Matches
with Males
Bob L. vs. Sue TL Fox/mixed exhibition bout: Scheduled 5 rounds in
Full-contact karate. Lopez quit in the third round. Fox won the
unsanctioned exhibition.
Unknown named Black Belt/male fighter vs. Sue TL Fox/mixed exhibition bout:
The male martial artist kicked Fox directly in the nose and fight was
stopped due to a severe nose bleed.
About female bouts in the the past:
In conclusion....without amateur boxing being allotted
for pioneer female boxers, many had a shaky start as a pro boxer. Many of the female boxers had to
jump right into fighting as a pro to gain any amateur experience....In the
past for female boxers---**Some fights on net documented as Sanctioned bouts
are in fact "not sanctioned" and were "in fact" Exhibitions
WBAN Celebrates 26 Years on the
Internet
(MAY 24, 2024) This month Women Boxing
Archive Network (WBAN) celebrates its 26 years on the Internet.
WBAN went live on the net on February 18, 1998. It has been
quite a journey and continues to be a journey in progress.
I want to thank all of you who have: Contributed photos,
stories, videos, press releases; Shared tips on boxing and
educated me about the sport; helped me stay updated on news,
fight results, and controversial issues in the sport.
Full
Story
April 28, 2022 -
WBAN's Upcoming Celebrating of 24 Years on the
Net Could Not come at a Better Time!
As women's boxing approaches one of the biggest fights in the
history of women's boxing with this Saturday’s huge fight between
multi-world champions Katie Taylor of Ireland vs. multi-world champion and WBAN's two-time world champion Amanda
"The Real Deal" Serrano -- it could not
be a better celebration for the sport of women's boxing! Full Story
Press Release: West Coast Hall of Fame Inducts Sue
TL Fox -On October 17, 2021,
Fox was
inducted into a second Hall of Fame
with the West Coast Boxing Hall of Fame,
that took place at Loew's Hotel, in Hollywood, California.
Full Story with Photos
Press Release: Boxing Manager II
Video Game features Sue TL Fox in an Episode
Source: press release
Link
to Boxing Manager II
(JAN 27, 2023) In the game, there is an awesome stable of
sluggers and staff, including iconic licensed characters, Sue "Tiger Lily"
Fox, Rocky Marciano tm and Sugar Ray Robinson tm! The boxing world is at
your fingertips in this deeply detailed and outrageously entertaining sports
management simulation.
Full Story
Photo Credits: [past b/w photos - The Columbian, The Oregonian, for
historical purposes only. |
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